Hi All!

...[B]ut it is also true that the person himself does not know this. So far as the person himself is concerned, all he knows is that he is desperate for love, and thinks he will be forever happy and content if he gets it. He does not know in advance he will strive on after this gratification has come, and that gratification of one basic need opens consciousness to domination by another 'higher' need. So far as he is concerned, the absolute, ultimate value synonomous with life itself, is whichever need in the hierarchy he is dominated by during a particular period.

It is true that human beings strive perpetually toward ultimate humaness, which itself may be a different kind of Being and becoming [growing].


--------------[end quote]

Question:

If 'heaven' could be attained on earth, how would our consciousness know this?

Hi All!

Perhaps these states of being [heaven on earth] lies waiting for us thru life, 'ready to step into for a time and to enjoy before we have to come back to our ordinary life of striving', as the experts so indicate.

And so these validations in life support the notion that being and becoming are not mutually exclusive. These experiences are rewards for both end goals and means; both arriving and striving for can be meaningful in themselves.

'Heaven on earth' is the purpose that sets ourselves apart from lower life forms and other animals. It is like the subconscious dangling carrot that is logically necessary for our being. We need it to survive.

What is this metaphorical carrot, and why does it have to exist in our minds?

Walrus

Dear Walrus,

RE "If 'heaven' could be attained on earth, how would our consciousness know this?"

This is a most worthy question, and one which will require some serious thought. If we were to achieve Heaven on Earth, how would we know this?

Hmm... need to think some more.

Peace, Ivan

Hi Ivan!

Existentialist A. Maslow says that these little doses of heaven are the [his] infamous peak-experiences or self-actualization he and other philosophers have labeled from observation of various empirical data (human values)wherein only a few people seem to achieve (though I suspect more than we know).

For instance, when I'm performing, sometimes I experience this heaven-like 'validation', yet it doesn't last forever. You probably have had similar experiences. It seems we are perpetually striving or even doomed forever by such a need or pursuit of this *constant* state of Being, for which we could never attain... .

Perhaps this is why some people turn to drugs. Another need... ?

Just some more thoughts.

Walrus

How do we know when Heaven is amongst us?

I think of Heaven as that stately domain of humanity when there is an inner contentment, a sense of peace within ourselves. I also think of it as a state where we are connected as human beings, with each other and with the heavens, that we are part of a much greater universe that is in harmony with us, as we are in harmony with its infinite Being. On a personal level, it is a centeredness within a harmonic whole; on a world scale level, it is a planet finally at peace radiating a collective inner joy in which all partake and from which flows an impetus to be better, more whole, more in tune with one another. Heaven on Earth is an agreeable state, one which leads us to cooperate more easily, and one where conflicts and coercions, where fear, become a memory of a much darker time of both our world history and our inner individual selves. We know that at both the atomic and cosmic levels the universe is a harmonious whole, one which is harmonic by design right down to the energy shells of single atoms. Why not carry this up to the macro world of men and women, where the harmony of musical notes penetrates down into our hearts and all of life? We are capable of so much more than we had been, for this had been our Dark Ages. Heaven will be here when we wake spiritually and realize consciously that we are already in it. And when all this comes to pass, we will know it as Love.

Ivan

Walrus, thank you for asking such an important question. I am sure there is much more that needs to be said about this. Let all who have their thoughts still locked in their hearts express them without fear of criticism or ridicule. We need not be shy when faced with the prospects of a truly wonderful world.

Subject: Making Pancakes -I'll try this again!


Making Pancakes


Six -year-old Brandon decided one Saturday morning to

fix his parents pancakes. He found a big bowl and spoon,

pulled a chair to the counter,

opened the cupboard and pulled out the heavy flour

canister, spilling it on the floor.


He scooped some of the flour into the bowl with his

hands, mixed in most of a cup of milk and added some sugar,

leaving a floury trail on the floor

which by now had a few tracks left by his kitten.


Brandon was covered with flour and getting frustrated.

He wanted this to be something very good for Mom and Dad,

but it was getting very bad.


He didn't know what to do next, whether to put it all

into the oven or on the stove and he didn't know how the stove worked!.

Suddenly he saw his kitten licking from the bowl of mix and reached to

push her away, knocking the egg carton to the floor. Frantically he

tried to clean up this monumental mess but slipped on the eggs,

getting his pajamas white and sticky.


And just then he saw Dad standing at the door. Big

crocodile tears welled up in Brandon's eyes.

All he'd wanted to do was something good, but

he'd made a terrible mess. He was sure a scolding was

coming, maybe even a spanking.

But his father just watched him.


Then, walking through the mess, he picked up his

crying son, hugged him and loved him, getting his own pajamas

white and sticky in the process.

That's how God deals with us. We try to do something

good in life, but it turns into a mess. Our marriage gets all sticky or

we insult a friend, or we can't stand our job, or our health goes sour.


Sometimes we just stand there in tears because we

can't think of anything else to do. That's when God picks us up

and loves us. Even though some of our mess gets all over Him.


But just because we might mess up, we can't stop

trying to "make pancakes" for God or for others.

Sooner or later we'll get it right, and then they'll be glad we tried...


Please pass some of this love on to others....suppose one morning

you were called to God; do all your friends know you love them?


I was thinking... and I wondered if I had any wounds

needing to be healed, friendships that need rekindling or three

words needing to be said, sometimes, "I love you" can heal & bless!

Remind every one of your friends that you love them.

Even if you think they don't love back, you would be

amazed at what those three little words, a smile, and

a reminder like this can do.


Just in case I haven't told you lately... I LOVE YA!!!



"Work like you don't need the money.

Love like you've never been hurt.

Dance like nobody's watching..."


(as forwarded)

Subject: Love Never Dies

The Get Ready For Love Show
Thursday, September 11, 2003
7-9PM PST

Love Never Dies

And I will dread witnessing June begin.
It will be strange for me with you so far.
I’ll be lonely watching the nights come in
For they will make me wonder where you are.
I’ll miss the grandeur of make-believing,
The old fantastic dreams that were such fun,
Interludes that blended joy with grieving,
The comfort of your arms when day was done.

Someday, perhaps, you’ll learn as well as I
That love is not an easy thing to die.
Perpetuity, Armando de peralta

Thursday, September 11th, join Viveca, The Buck and Our Love Loss Recovery Luminaries for a thoughtful evening … part tribute to those we’ve loved and lost … part celebration for the Love in our lives and the Love opportunities that surround us in the precious present.

… Gary and Kathy Young, authors, Loss and Found How We Survived The Loss of a Young Spouse … survivors … from loss to love again in each other’s arms … a beautiful love story.

…Wendy Keller, Founder, www.LifePresent.org … moments before the accident she had been a mother of two, a wife, a healthy, active young woman, age 26. Life isn’t about what happens … it’s about what you do after it happens …

… Dr. Belle, if you or someone you Love is lost in grief … the mind can be a bad neighborhood - don’t go there alone … warning signs … save yourself … and how to break the “habit” of heartache and resolve your past …

… Viveca & The Buck … NOW he/she knows … find them … let them know you care NOW … how to make amends and get Love back on track … acceptance for the things you cannot change … Life is a short trip … enjoy ...

The Get Ready For Love Show is a weekly public forum on the subject of Love where we come together to share wisdom, strength, insight and hope. Listen 24/7 to Love topics archived at www.GetReadyForLove.Com

Do you have something to share? Do you have a question, an opinion, an insight or an inspiration for us on this topic? Feel free to call in at 1-888-327-0061 from 7-9PM PST on Thursday, September 11th or email Viveca@GetReadyForLove.Com

Where are we, to be so filled with self importance, without love?

http://www.planetary.org/html/society/advisors/sagandot.html

Earth from 4 billion miles away.

Z

FROM THE HEART OF THE UNIVERSE?

HEAR THE BLACK HOLE SING
http://www.msnbc.com/news/974008.asp?0dm=C2CHT

A SONG OF THE HEART
http://www.ymec.com/hp/signal2/heart4.htm

Music from the heart of the Universe is in the heart.
While you live, the Universe sings with you, down to the harmonics of atom shells.
Atomus Summus-2
Postcripts on "Electron Harmonics", June 12, 2003

Life as Energy is Alive. Only a small step from song to life and love.

Ivan

Question: If 'heaven' could be attained on earth, how would our consciousness know this?

Interesting dillema. Surely, heaven is here and now, just beyond our fingertips and beneath our noses. But if we allow ourselves the pointing finger of "obtaining" without confusing the finger with what is pointed at, we still end up in a catch. In such obtaining, the entire idea of conciousness must dissolve. And along with, the idea of "obtaining".

Now, isn't that funny.

FIND THE LOVE.

How close can I get to you to cause the least pain?

This is always the unspoken question when two beings approach each other. How can I avoid getting hurt by our closeness? It is not only true for human beings, but applies to the animal world also. If a predator approaches its prey, the question takes on a different tone. How close can I get to you to not get hurt myself? To the prey, the question is different too. How close can I get to you before you hurt me? The desire for closeness is always present, but the fear of pain balances out that desire into a necessary distance between them. This is more true for humans approaching each other, because they really have a need of closeness. But the fear keeps them apart at a distance, sometimes both physically and emotionally.

A mistrust may be inborn. When I first met my future friends Karu and Gentle, part Australian heeler and part North American timber wolf, the male could not wait to make friends with me, though he was chained. It was love at first sight, almost as if we already knew each other. The female on the other hand was shy and circled me a number of times before smelling my hand. They were just over six months old, and already had personality traits that distinguished them. Now when they approach me, nearly twelve years later, it is from pure love and trust. The same is told of animal trainers, that once they gain acceptance and trust from their animals, whether tiger or bear or wolf, or most animals, they are accepted with love from them. This is why it is so unusual to have them turn against us at times, though it happens, often in some moment of stress. Once the wall of distrust is broken, there is total acceptance at some basic fundamental level, and a bond of love develops, for a lifetime. That bond once achieved is a powerful force between beings, whether animal or human, and a kinship of love no longer asks if that closeness will cause pain. We know instinctively that this love and trust is from a place of joy.

Humans are merely more consciously evolved animals, so though the question of how close can we come to not cause pain is more complex, it is nevertheless the same urge. We want to approach, but are guarded by our fear of the other hurting us, or we hurting them. Sometimes the distance is a respectable one, such as we experience in our professional lives, or with neighbors, so that there is never danger of getting too close. Nor is there need for it being more. But in our personal relationships, when we want that closeness, seeking that love, the barrier must be taken down a little at a time. Such is dating, or spending time together, to better become aquainted. Humans are verbose, so we talk a lot. We know when this barrier is dissolving when we talk less, and are more comfortable just being. The trust enters, and our needs for verbal defenses melt away. As we get closer, we find the love, and the safety that comes from within that love of being together. This is why when such trust is achieved, and one totally trusts the other, when all fears had been removed, that it is so incredibly painful to find that trust broken. Infidelity is one such time, where the pain is exceedingly great to the love broken. Or having done something hurtful, disrespectful, or wrong in the eyes of the other, and trust is damaged. Then the old wall of fear rears up again, and the distance of least pain once again takes over. If I did something to hurt my wolf dog friends, which I do my very best to never let happen, I know their trust would be gone, or damaged, and with it their unconditional love. But humans, being more complex, are easier to hurt, to disappoint, so it takes an even greater awareness of when this trust may be damaged. We must be so totally aware of not causing pain to the other, in some form of trespass, or perhaps some deceit or slight, or worse with violence. That trust gained is such a precious gift from the other that we should never ever take it for granted. But when this gift of love is bestowed on us, it is an incredible comfort and joy, a peace in ourselves with the other, that exceeds anything gained from risking its loss. That closeness is between two living human beings, same as it is between all living things, two separate universes come together as one. And when it happens, when that love is found, there is joy from deep in the heart.

So there should be a new awareness in us, in all human beings conscious of who they are, those of us who have reached that stage, with all living things. We know we are there when instead of asking how close can we get without pain, we seek to merge with the heart and mind of the other in total trust, with love. Then we know we are truly evolved in our awareness.

How close can I get to you to cause the most joy?

That is how you find the love.

Ivan

See: Find the Love II (April 16, 2005), continued.

such a good idea - why aren't there more current messages being written?

pmdigi, no more current messages here?

it is because there are many shy readers and
even quieter writers. leave behind what
thoughts you will, they are much appreciated
and welcome.

ivan

"An Attic Philosopher in Paris" by Emile Souvestre (1806-1854).

Original title: "Un Philosophe sous les Toits"

This is my favorite philosophy book of all time, read it long ago and it never tires.

It can be downloaded for free from Gutenberg.org: http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/3999

Ivan